Winds of Dawn Clan Forum - RP- Character vs Clicker

Bob the Archer

01-27-2003, 02:27 AM

The other day I was trying to explain what Role Playing is and why it is fun.

This was in response to a survey (http://www.homenetresearch.org/massive/) about MMORPGs. (Take the survey, maybe win 3 free months of CL!)

It is a challenge to develop an idea for a character, stay in character when playing, and develop the character in a way consistent with the motivations and goals of that persona. When done well, it is fantastic.

Of course, when no effort is made to RP, then the character is mearly validating the clickers persistence in running a rat's laberynth of chasing bots and gathering loot/ power.

Sometimes our (clickers) ideas and goals for our characters change over time, or we find it simply impossible to achieve the goal we tried to reach.

Change can be good. Let me use the example of comic strips. Calvin and Hobbes was an outstanding story with facinating characters. Yet, when the cartoonist felt that he had sufficently explored the posibilities of the strip, he discontinued it, his story told. For Better of For Worse has been running a developmental story line for 20 years and is still going strong. Its dynamic is change in the lives of its Characters.

How have we changed how we RP our CL characters to maintain an intrest in the game? Have we widened their focus from a narrow point to a broad spectrum of intrests?

And also, do you find it more enjoyable and relaxing as a Clicker to RP a Character who is closer to your natural personality, or one diffrennt enough to make the challenge of doing a good RP job rewarding in and of itself?

-HWC Bob

Hidden

01-27-2003, 03:45 AM

I gave roleplaying in CL the good old college try way back when, about 3 years ago when I was just starting. This lasted about a year, until I realized that most of the people in the world can't act for shit. And that most of those people were playing CL. I got bored of the people who assumed "roleplaying" was a synonym for "cookie-cutter scripted melodrama". That's about when I mostly stopped playing my first healer and switched to Hidden. Hidden is much closer to HWC in personality, though the line has definitely blurred a lot.

These days I get my yucks in CL from the deep and fun combat system, not so much the roleplaying, though when a situation comes up, I do try to stay in character.

On the subject of narrow focus vs. broad interests, a narrowly focused character cannot and will not last more than a month at best. Let's say, for example, a Dwarf who spends every last second in town begging for hand outs to get drunk. I don't know about you, but the longest I could stand to do that is about an hour. Someone really dedicated to the idea might last a month.

I find it much more relaxing to play a character closer to my regular personality. If I'm playing something pretty much similar to myself, I don't have to worry if I'm getting it right every 5 seconds. Much less stressful.

Nunul

01-27-2003, 04:38 AM

Originally posted by Bob the Archer
Calvin and Hobbes was an outstanding story with facinating characters. Yet, when the cartoonist felt that he had sufficently explored the posibilities of the strip, he discontinued it, his story told.

Erm. My sources tell me it was the author's unhappiness with the comercialism/marketing of his work what turned him off.
(I met a guy in a Barnes & Noble once who knew the author)
I guess he never intended it to be his "Job", but rather an outlet of his passion. I hear he is a happier man now.

C&H is splendid. I have a couple treasuries (normally lying in a sacred spot of my favorite sitting/reading area. <G> I'll give a hint: Its a small room with only one seat...unless you happen to be rich and love yer hygine.)

Unregistered

01-27-2003, 06:14 AM

(This is PWC Ruen posting, I'm posting unregistered on purpose, since most of Ruen's post are IC.)

Playing a character is certainly a big part of the draw for me in Clan Lord. I like roleplaying games, and have been involved in many table-top and "live-action" games over the years. I'm also no stranger to Muds which is really what Clanlord feels the most like.

I think my approach is somewhat different from HWC Bob. I came up with a background story and a basic personality for Ruen, and I've just taken it from there. Ruen has changed in the nearly two and a half IC years she has been in Puddleby, and those changes have been largely the result of her experiences. The main reason why Ruen has a journal is so that I can keep track of what has happened to her and explore how she feels about it. That's why the journal isn't a great work or writing and is pretty repetative, with lots of stories about hunting in south forest. Its meant to be a reflection of Ruen's reality, which currently involves a lot of not-terribly-interesting-to-veterans hunts near the mirror. I don't really have any goals for Ruen, but she has a few of her own, which will almost certainly change with time. Her short term goal right now is to get a chain :).

I have to concur with Hidden about the difficulties of staying IC. Its hard to do. Sometimes when your modem D/Cs you in the middle of the Dark Temple (which has happened at least twice, and I don't go there a lot) its pretty hard not to just blurt out the explaination. "I fainted" sounds pretty lame at that point. Another tough one for me is having a friend who has started to be clicked by two different people... that's pretty disconcerting as a role-player, and I like both players involved, so I'm afraid I've been letting it slide. On the other hand, I have found that by stayings as IC as possible, the folks I regularly hunt with have followed suit and also stay IC almost all the time, which makes things a lot easier.

I also agree with Hidden on the "scripted melodrama" types. I've met a few of those. I find them irritating. Ruen thinks they are emotionally unbalanced and avoids anyone who does it around her. She'd much rather hang out with the hard-core rank whores -- they at least behave consistantly. Not to mention people who want to constantly talk about all the woe that has befallen them, much of it too silly to believe, aren't terribly interesting for more than two minutes. Something bad happened to Ruen prior to her arrival in Puddleby (as is likely true with most of the residents) but Ruen is a sane person and doesn't like to talk about it at all, much less blurt it out in gory detail to everyone she meets.

I certainly hope that I can continue to play in character. I think that's likely. Perversly, I think that being a much weaker character is an advantage here. The really strong characters have fewer options as to whom they can hunt with, and being able to pick and choose the more consistant roleplayers as hunting companions and such is pretty important to being able to stick with it.

--PWC Ruen

Kiriel

01-27-2003, 08:57 AM

Personally I like a little light roleplaying but I'm not the type to get into any of the hard core stuff, and I have no problem slipping out of character. I used to stick to IC a lot more but these days most of the folks I hunt with go OOC a lot and I've gotten lazy.

The kind of roleplaying I do is mostly just sticking to my mental picture of what each of my characters is like as a person and trying to make them follow that. I have three characters and each one of them has a distinct personality. Although in a lot of ways they're like me, they all have their special quirks and there are things they do differently (one of my characters is a dwarf and brews, which is difficult for me as I don't drink at all and have a hard time playing up the experience of getting drunk). I do have a lot more appreciation for folks who at least make half an attempt at roleplaying their characters, especially those who have multiple characters that they don't keep very separate.

To me the elaborate roleplaying stories some folks make up are mostly annoying and I generally steer clear of them. I'm cool with individuals having their own personal character backgrounds but when they start doing complicated scripts that require participation by folks who don't subscribe to their roleplaying style it gets unpleasant. I don't really need a bad soap opera in my game (and I watch soaps, so trust me I know). If folks enjoy that it's cool, but sometimes they try to involve me and that's where I usually try to get away.

Poesy

01-27-2003, 09:06 AM

[:)] Poesy's clicker agrees with Ruen's clicker.
I also keep a journal for Poesy for pretty much the same reasons, because it gives her more of a chance to think about what's actually happening to her, rather than just focusing on the next monster or the next rank. By clothing clicking through Clan Lord with a bit of a story, I think it makes it much more interesting. If you tell a little bit of a story even hunting through South Forest for the 100th time can be interesting. And I think reading other people's journals makes the world seem richer. Except for the melodramatic ones... Give me a set of waders please! (I recall some vision stone's I've sat through that involve an excesive amount of weeping and dramatic predictions.) Poesy can be occationally melodramatic, but most of the time she's either pragmatic, or a clown. [:D]

Poesy tries to stay in character when she plays... but often she forgets... She's very much a slice of my personality, but only a slice, and sometimes I forget. And I do try to keep Poesy and Peony from being the same character, they do have different premises, but sometimes I get lazy.

Poesy also likes to hunt with people that will talk to her some too... She gets pretty exasperated with some of the exiles who seem to be mute zombies. They don't even have to say anything particularly deep either...

Oops, I'm rambling, back to work.
--SWC Poesy

Himitsu

01-27-2003, 09:26 AM

I also have created a story for Himitsu, long-term goals, and some typical responses to situations. She tries to remain IC except for the one embarrasing time in the opening ceremonies for the Newbielympics when she got disconnected. [:o] She likes comparing people and situations to food or clothes, which is consistent with her background. She also likes kidding around and when someone laughs when they were before frowning or looking stoic, even at her, she's happy. She also doesn't try to let life get her depressed since she's having too much fun.

For the most part, SWC finds this pretty easy because of the planning she's done although when the mystic FMOCR fiasco happened, SWC had to ask herself what SWC would do and what Himitsu would do and to seperate the two since they turned out to be very different. SWC would leave the Mystic Guild entirely but, when SWC thought about it, realized that Himitsu would never do such a thing. SWC asked herself "What would Himitsu do and say?" and then she knew the answer.

Himitsu also agrees with SWC Ruen in that the melodramatic people really get on her nerves. Why let a tragic past make your present and future also tragic? Puddleby is an island full of possibilities! You can be what you want to be! However, it seems that some people enjoy being depressed and suffering. I really don't understand that.

Konoko

01-27-2003, 09:32 AM

Bob asked:
And also, do you find it more enjoyable and relaxing as a Clicker to RP a Character who is closer to your natural personality, or one diffrennt enough to make the challenge of doing a good RP job rewarding in and of itself?
I think it would be much easier to to have a character follow your own natural style/personality. That's what I've noticed anyways.
Sure it would be possible not to, but that would require more work :)

I have 3 characters. If I'm in the mood where I don't really want to talk or visit and stuff then I just use my second character. He's in a clan but doesn't have too many friends that are still around. I can use him when I just want to go out and waste some time and stuff. Not having too many people around that know him and stuff, means not too much talking - but is kind of lonely. I hardly ever use him - he's definitely in the library more than Konoko is!

My third character is a healer. I'm glad I became a fighter because healing is not my cup of tea. I never use the healer - I actually find healing kind of boring. I don't know why - maybe I just never gave it a serious chance. It might come down to patience too - as I've said a number of times before I don't really have much :)
It is nice to be able to go out and do stuff and not require a healer to heal you but not being able to fight things well is a definite disadvantage. Perhaps I've just been a fighter too long?
Following this - I guess it is a sort of role-playing, I'm not really focusing on skills to heal others but just to keep the character alive. No need for horus or a cad then! :)

Steady Foot

02-03-2003, 05:37 PM

I have 3 characters. If I'm in the mood where I don't really want to talk or visit and stuff then I just use my second character. He's in a clan but doesn't have too many friends that are still around.

I have serveral also. My alter ego I definitely role play. I can't reveal too much about this character, otherwise you will know who it is...[:)] Much differenct then Steady.

Steady Foot is more like my own self. [:)]

Michael

02-04-2003, 06:41 AM

Originally posted by Hidden

Ditto. I could give a fuck abou pretending that I am some bla bla bal (insert boring back story). But when a story comes up in the game I try to stay IC to whats going on.

[B]
I find it much more relaxing to play a character closer to my regular personality. If I'm playing something pretty much similar to myself, I don't have to worry if I'm getting it right every 5 seconds. Much less stressful.

Its much more fun to interact with people that DONT RP. I dont give a shit about some damn elf who was ass-raped by a pack of wild ferals when he was 10 after eating his parents, its much more interesting to hear about who the OOC people are.

Valtrim

02-04-2003, 11:57 AM

<soapbox>

From what I can see, I tend to agree with most of the people who've posted to this thread. If I'm running or playing in a tabletop session, I'll make heavy use of any stereotypes I'm aware of, which allows me a broad range of personalities and behaviors at the expense of character depth. In a MMORPG, ideally you'd have a fair variety of personalities in the player base such that if everyone were to play a personality pretty close to their own you'd end up with both variety and depth in characters.

IMO, playing one's own personality also makes conflict more interesting. I prefer that people (myself included) feel at least a bit of what their characters feel. The more detached a person is from his/her character, the less consistent the character's personality will tend to be; staying in-character is far easier when your own knee-jerk reactions are in line with your character's personality. I find that people who attempt to deviate the farthest from their own experiences (those whom most people on CL call "roleplayers") are those who often need to break character in really spectacular (and story-jarring) ways.

That said, if I do break character, it's typically obvious that it's a player comment rather than Valtrim talking. There are times when I can't resist an attempt at an IC joke with an OOC reference, but I'm far from perfect.

On a related note, it's my belief that everyone in a roleplaying game roleplays. Characters who make things melodramatic are referred to by Valtrim as "actors".

</soapbox>

HWC for Valtrim

Manx

02-05-2003, 12:29 PM

In the beginning, I tried to roleplay my characters pretty strictly. At the time, I think I had 3 characters, and each had a very distinct personality - mostly based on and played during particular moods I have. I have 7 characters now, and a few of them are pretty similar in personality (close enough to have friends of one character ask if I also click the other). Those characters that I enjoy playing the most are closest to my own personality. Other characters don't really seem like me, but are likely constructed (in part, at least) of less prominent aspects of my personality.

When I roleplayed in some of the more dedicated CL RP circles, I was frequently annoyed by how some players take on a DM attitude and try to write/control the personalities of other player's characters. Several RPers constantly battled me for control of Manx's personality, trying to get me to play her as a darker, stronger, or more clever creature. One of the things I enjoy most about Manx is that she's naive and relatively unaffected. I believe she provides a great foil for less scrupulous characters in the community, but I think her folksy personality irritates some players as well as characters. Her wishy-washiness is a major aspect of her personality (not really mine, but it's fun to play), but some clanners have gone so far as to contact me ooc and urge Manx to choose up sides on issues. She is staunchly loyal to her friends, but has friends on both sides.

"There is no story without conflict" becomes a familiar phrase. I assume it means we're all supposed to take a stand and fight the opposition to the bloody end in order for a story to play out in dramatic fashion. I think straddling the fence and being torn between friends provides as much potential for conflict as taking a stand, but I sorta gave up on hard-core RPing about the time I realized many RPers could not figure out how to play off of a character like Manx. My other characters, who are more corruptible to varying degrees, seem to appeal more to other RPers. They're a blast to play too, but I often feel that only unscrupulous, obsessed, victimized, or outraged characters are looked on as valid personality types in role play. That's discouraging.

Anyway, I don't RP much in the pure RP tradition any more. I have a whole lot more fun playing with my RW friends than watching sylvans faint or poison themselves in town. We have been known to stay completely OOC (gasp!) for hours on a hunt. I don't know how much that bothers others, but staying IC every day for the duration of 4-hour hunts or explorations can get exhausting/boring. The hunt and battle mechanics of CL are so well-designed, that it's a tremendous pleasure to focus on attaining skills in that area (not to mention I have almost total control of how I chart my path). The GM-driven storylines and exploration potential in CL are enjoyable, but often frustrating and futile. The player-driven melodramas are almost always confusing and irritating.

Whoops, I forgot what the original post was about. Hopefully, I stayed sorta on topic.

Ayella

02-05-2003, 03:20 PM

Originally posted by Manx
I have a whole lot more fun playing with my RW friends than watching sylvans faint or poison themselves in town. .... The player-driven melodramas are almost always confusing and irritating.

OOC

Hm. I kind of resent this. Why are sylvans picked out? Many RP that are not sylvans, and many are very melodramatic.

Ayella is my Role Playing character. I have a "rankwhore" character, I suppose. She was my first, and I love her to pieces, but after a while I got extremely bored of logging on, going on a big hunt, making ranks and signing off. So I created Ayella. She's a helluva lot more fun for me. Of course, she has her own personality that I have to follow, but I see it as a sort of challenge. Seeing if I can stay IC.

My other character is more like my personality (perhaps a bit bitchier [;)]) and I do enjoy playing her. Especially when I've had a bad day! I can just relax and not worry about staying IC.

Heh. I don't see Manx as "wishy-washy", in my opinion she's actually pretty cool. But maybe I'm too busy poisoning myself to notice the wishy-washiness!! [:D]

---
SWC Ayella

Manx

02-05-2003, 04:37 PM

Hm. I kind of resent this. Why are sylvans picked out? Many RP that are not sylvans, and many are very melodramatic.

Sorry if I've stepped on any toes, but I have to say the vast majority of hystrionics I've been exposed to is generated by sylvans. Virtually every character who wanted to push their ideas and opinions on how I should roleplay Manx, were sylvans or clicked a sylvan as their primary RP character. I don't know why this is. I don't know if the avatar just appeals more to melodramatic players, or if Manx is a magnet for sylvan-types.

Anyhow, I'm not opposed to melodrama if the story is interesting and it's not shoved down my throat (or, as in the case of a notorious Noxie, shoved into the back of my neck).

I also click a sylvan, but my most melodramatic character is a thoom.

Hidden

02-05-2003, 07:17 PM

I think it has to do with the fact that "elf" is such a stereotypical "fantasy" race, and thus is drawn towards prominent feature and therefore drama in books. Books people read. Books people emulate.

In any given game, the most forced, overdone, melodramatic, spastic crap is always put forth by people who play elves. It's really the only thing the race has going for it.

Bob the Archer

02-05-2003, 11:05 PM

I was interested in Clan Lord long before I had the actual access to begin playing myself. I read the scrolls, even downloaded a few visionstones.

Bob is the first- and only- character I've clicked. I know a few people asked me about the Archer idea; yes, I was aware of John Arrowish and of the lack of bows before I started clanning. I thought it might be interesting to have a character's main focus that of finding a bow in a land without one.

The personality of Bob has changed- He was origionaly a D&D character, young, rash, impetious. In many ways, when he was a tabletop character, his style of play was simular to Lozzy Diuberr.

In Clan Lord, he has become a way for me to relax- he is calmer, more thoughtful. Rash may be fun, but being a pain in the ass to the friendly healers isn't fun for me. If I had continued to behave that way, I am sure i would have lain around fallen a lot, departed often, and given up the game in a few months.

When I chose to reset Bob instead of religating him to a library character while I started another, it was for two main reasons: I don't have time to click two characters well, and I felt that there was value in continuing the story of a character questing for a bow. I definitly feel as if i am in the minority in maintaining a strict one character policy for myself, but it has the added benifit of continuity of relationships and reputations. For me, giving up 700 ranks was better than giving up my character's essence.

BTW, the only reason I chose a Sylvan character was the bow on the icon. The icon was more important than any racial boni to me.

Clan Lord is a cooperative experience. This is one of the main reasons I feel that so many of us center our characters on our own personalities. When we play other games, games that may focus the experience on other aspects than personality and cooperation (Diablo II on Battlenet is far different, EQ closer to D2 than CL IMHO) We may assume other identities. When I play tabletop games, I also go for more drama, more powerful emotions. Maybe that is because In CL, me character is developed a little at a time with each game session, but far more frequently, and over a longer period of time than any tabletop character.

-HWC Bob the Archer

Unregistered

02-06-2003, 06:02 AM

I haven't been able to get enough time to clan for about a week and a half, but I was briefly skimming the news group last night when I read about this roleplaying contest that one of the GMs is holding, and I thought this might be an appropriate thread to rant about it in.

The way its phrased, "create a player driven storyline", seems to me to make it the worst idea I've heard in a while. To me, this seems to be an invitation to the melodramatic types to let loose with their whackiest, most convoluted scripted soap operas. Perhaps I should hide in the library until its all over. It also makes me think that Eldon GM missed GMing 101.

Here's what I think is wrong with the notion, I'd appreciate comments, etc. from other people:

In any roleplaying game (table-top, live-action, or computer) it is the GMs job to create the world. It is the players job to have their characters react to the world in a reasonable (for that character) manner. Players can add to the world by making up a back story for their characters that fits into the world as defined by the GMs, by adding inconsequential details and such, by taking actions in character that will change the world, etc. How NPC act, and how the eternal world works needs to be run by the GMs both for consistancy and to help the world seem real for the characters. The actions of a character are up to the player of that character and not the GMs or other players, otherwise the character isn't consistant. Scripting ahead by players is bad, because you loose the feeling of spontanaity, the fantasy, and it just becomes acting then (usually bad acting). Scripting by the GMs is bad because it tends to lead to railroading the characters down certain paths, which is no fun, though its certainly acceptable to think of the likely outcomes ahead of time.

It seems to me that Eldon GM is trying to get players to do the GMs job by running this contest. I think its a mistaken notion and is doomed. If they want people to roleplay more, there are lots of better ways of doing it. Making the world more consistant would be a good start.

PWC Ruen

Michael

02-06-2003, 06:16 AM

Originally posted by Unregistered

It seems to me that Eldon GM is trying to get players to do the GMs job by running this contest. I think its a mistaken notion and is doomed. If they want people to roleplay more, there are lots of better ways of doing it. Making the world more consistant would be a good start.

PWC Ruen

I dont think its a great idea either, but I do give credit to eldon for trying.

Valtrim

02-06-2003, 08:51 AM

Originally posted by Ruen
Scripting ahead by players is bad, because you loose the feeling of spontanaity, the fantasy, and it just becomes acting then (usually bad acting). Scripting by the GMs is bad because it tends to lead to railroading the characters down certain paths, which is no fun, though its certainly acceptable to think of the likely outcomes ahead of time.

Agreed. When Eldon had a Q&A session regarding the contest in the fairgrounds, I mentioned to him that a given plot's flexibility should be one of the criteria for judgement. He seemed to agree.

If I'd have thought about it, I'd have asked that another of the criteria be how seamlessly the plot was able to integrate players who weren't aware that anything out of the ordinary was happening (and, by that token, how seamlessly it meshed with the established game world). Having to tell people "please pretend such-and-such" when they start messing with your story is silly, but a player-driven plot which has a consistent causal chain, can be shaped by characters who weren't involved in its inception, and is open-ended (by which I mean that any conclusion is possible, not just a set of pre-determined ones) could be interesting.

HWC for Valtrim

Brune

02-06-2003, 11:09 AM

PWC Ruen wrote:
In any roleplaying game (table-top, live-action, or computer) it is the GMs job to create the world. It is the players job to have their characters react to the world in a reasonable (for that character) manner.

Barriers to GM-independent stories include:

1) Icons can DO extremely little in the world. They can pick up and drop things, interact with critters, and move around. Plus they can /useitems, in a very limited way. But there is not a lot you can do to experiment with the world beyond your icon. For example, "I wonder what would happen to an undine if I touched it with my Mercurial Staff?"

Darn...I'll never know...unless I pretend (which is fine, but it leads to the next point...)

2) There are no external rules about "how the clan lord universe works." Therefore, there is no common view of what WOULD happen IF we tried to do a thing. For example:

/action targets the Liche with his Mercurial Staff, to weaken the critter while the fighters bash it.

if everyone has read the chapter on undine, people can agree on the following...

"Yay, I helped vanquish a Liche with my Staff!"

Fighters: "Thanks! Healers are good for fighting undine!"

if there is no chapter on undine, then:

"Yay, I helped!"

Fighters: "WTF are you talking about, you just stood there, and didnt even bother healing anybody. Eff you, and why wont the effing gms give us an effing good spawn?! This update sux!"

3) Items in Clan Lord are somewhat useful, but very limited. We could drive plots and involve others (to whatever degree they wish), if we could communicate a "commonly held context."
Say I'd like to pretend I found a ring in the mountains. To everyone else it would appear that:
/info... he is wearing a sylphstone (or wedding) ring.

No one is going to ask "where did you get that ring, and why are you acting so stupid?" (well, they probably won't)

But, if I could /name it "strange ring with symbol," someone might ask. And even a casual roleplayer (like me) could readily join in, without anyone having to say (OOC: pretend that's a weird ring. really. just go along, ok?)

I don't know if there are any real solutions. Without GM refereeing, one player is faced with having to manipulate others to drive a plot. And that's something I will not participate in. On the other hand, open-ended roleplaying allows people to do what they want, but can be unproductive without a "common context" and feedback from the world itself (e.g. the Liche writhes in pain from the effects of the mercurial staff).

While I don't have high hopes for this contest, who can say that nothing good will come of it?

Michael

02-06-2003, 11:43 AM

Originally posted by Brune
PWC Ruen wrote:

2) There are no external rules about "how the clan lord universe works." Therefore, there is no common view of what WOULD happen IF we tried to do a thing. For example:

/action targets the Liche with his Mercurial Staff, to weaken the critter while the fighters bash it.

if everyone has read the chapter on undine, people can agree on the following...

"Yay, I helped vanquish a Liche with my Staff!"

Fighters: "Thanks! Healers are good for fighting undine!"

if there is no chapter on undine, then:

"Yay, I helped!"

Fighters: "WTF are you talking about, you just stood there, and didnt even bother healing anybody. Eff you, and why wont the effing gms give us an effing good spawn?! This update sux!"

I dont know about the rest of the RWs (I have a pretty good idea though), but I am not gonna pretend someone is useful if they are not. I dont give a fuck what kind of back story there is to it. You stand there and not heal me when I am bricking a liche dont expect me to be happy about it.

Unregistered

02-06-2003, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by Brune
Barriers to GM-independent stories include:

1) Icons can DO extremely little in the world. They can pick up and drop things, interact with critters, and move around. Plus they can /useitems, in a very limited way. But there is not a lot you can do to experiment with the world beyond your icon. For example, "I wonder what would happen to an undine if I touched it with my Mercurial Staff?"

Well

Konoko

02-06-2003, 02:47 PM

Brune posted:
"Yay, I helped!"

Fighters: "WTF are you talking about, you just stood there, and didnt even bother healing anybody.

I can just imagine this - very funny! :)

It would be difficult to roleplay stuff like this if the others are unaware what you're doing. And if they actually expect a healer to heal instead of roleplaying some cool healer-undine battle. I guess that's always a concern/problem for all this role-playing stuff...

Michael

02-07-2003, 06:23 AM

Originally posted by Manx

Sorry if I've stepped on any toes, but I have to say the vast majority of hystrionics I've been exposed to is generated by sylvans. Virtually every character who wanted to push their ideas and opinions on how I should roleplay Manx, were sylvans or clicked a sylvan as their primary RP character. I don't know why this is. I don't know if the avatar just appeals more to melodramatic players, or if Manx is a magnet for sylvan-types.

Anyhow, I'm not opposed to melodrama if the story is interesting and it's not shoved down my throat (or, as in the case of a notorious Noxie, shoved into the back of my neck).

I also click a sylvan, but my most melodramatic character is a thoom.

I agree with Manx. Most of the piss poor RP that makes me want to fucking vomit seems to come from Sylvans flopping around in town center.

Twilth

02-07-2003, 09:10 PM

Originally posted by Hidden
I think it has to do with the fact that "elf" is such a stereotypical "fantasy" race, and thus is drawn towards prominent feature and therefore drama in books. Books people read. Books people emulate.

In any given game, the most forced, overdone, melodramatic, spastic crap is always put forth by people who play elves. It's really the only thing the race has going for it.

Heh, I remember how I wanted Twilth to be a human in the beginning, but chose sylvan because I didn't want a beefed-up soccer ball headed icon.
I really do hope DT will use the knightly icon I saw in the Feast of Tsrrin for humans. [:)]

Originally posted by Brune
"Yay, I helped!"

Fighters: "WTF are you talking about, you just stood there, and didnt even bother healing anybody. Eff you, and why wont the effing gms give us an effing good spawn?! This update sux!"

That reminds me of what a friend of mine who used to play Clan Lord told me once. He tried to roleplay a posessed character, and every once in a while on a hunt he'd kill himself with a slyphstone ring and come back as some evil persona when he was healed. Eventually the people on the hunt stopped healing him altogether every time that happened. [:D]

Twilth is pretty close to what I'm actually like as a real person. I wouldn't really want to play as a totally different character because I'd probably be constantly questioning what I would do and what the character would do.
In the beginning, all I really had was a personality for Twilth, and made up the background as I went along. Occasionally I edited his history, I being a perfectionist, and hoped that no one would notice.
Twilth used to be a traveling storyteller, and I do try to keep that role up, ie comparing life to roads or stories or such and such. A lot of people say they would want to hear stories from Twilth, but I find that hard to do, as I can't say I'm a very good short story writer. [:D] The few stories that Twilth has told are old legends that have been adapted into the Clan Lord universe.
Twilth is not static, and has indeed changed in the few years that he has been in Puddleby. The singlular persona of a traveling storyteller has evolved quite a bit as I've role-played him, as I've found out what he would do in what situation. I imagine that Twilth would be the kind of person that I would want to be, if I could be anyone else.
These days I notice a lot of the time Twilth becomes silly, and if he does, it's probably just me getting bored of roleplaying his character and being more of myself instead.

-TWC Twilth

Catlin

02-08-2003, 01:56 PM

Originally posted by Hidden

In any given game, the most forced, overdone, melodramatic, spastic crap is always put forth by people who play elves. It's really the only thing the race has going for it. [/B]

Nah. It's the pointy ears ;)

Catlin =^..^=

Dani Diuberr

02-13-2003, 07:03 AM

Just out of interest, does anyone click for a character of the opposite gender to him/herself?

SWC - Dani

Michael

02-13-2003, 07:19 AM

Originally posted by Dani Diuberr
Just out of interest, does anyone click for a character of the opposite gender to him/herself?

SWC - Dani

MANY people do.

I do, but not by choice. I took over an account that was not mine, and some of the characters were female. I am not happy about it, but there is no way to change it for me. Its part of the reason I make no secrect who the female healer I play the most really is.

If some guy ever started hitting on me (for real, not just fucking around) I would fucking puke all over my monitor.

Side note: Have I mentioned that I hate GMs yet today?

Kiriel

02-13-2003, 08:19 AM

All my characters are female like me, but my husband has one female and one male character (his female character was acquired but he might have created one himself- he often did when he played Everquest). I know offhand of quite a few female characters played by men, and the occasional male character played by women (those seem to be more rare).

tomair

02-13-2003, 08:40 AM

Hoi,
I have one other char, who is male, my son however has a char that is female, pretty heavy for a 15 (almost16 )year old boy huh...

I only see the chars in the game as real persons and treat them accordingly, it is of no consequence to me who they OOC are... Mike is a ... no i wont say. Who he or she is in "real" life is not important except for Mike and the people who are near him ( if any). I am just using him as an example, could have used Kiri as well of course. My point is that when IC we all are the persons we want to be/are. I am a friendly healer or a still standing Zo...[;)]

Tomair, your friendly healer

Bob the Archer

02-13-2003, 08:40 AM

Originally posted by Dani Diuberr
Just out of interest, does anyone click for a character of the opposite gender to him/herself?

SWC - Dani

One of the things i like about CL is that a greater percentage of clickers seem to click themselves (that means a personality and gender based on there own) It is a refreshing change from other games where every elven maiden is clicked by a 14 year old pizza faced boy, and all the women clickers hide their real gender behind Barbarian Brezerks for fear of harrasment.

Hidden

02-13-2003, 11:27 AM

Originally posted by Bob the Archer
It is a refreshing change from other games where every elven maiden is clicked by a 14 year old pizza faced boy,
See: Pre-rip Minis (and, I would bet, a good deal of the post-rip ones)
and all the women clickers hide their real gender behind Barbarian Brezerks for fear of harrasment.
See: Babajaga.

*ducks*

Mehan

02-13-2003, 01:23 PM

and all the women clickers hide their real gender behind Barbarian Brezerks for fear of harrasment.

How many people pick on Zo ;)

Lilly

02-16-2003, 07:51 PM

I tried to make most of my roleplaying something that would give people a goal, or a unified purpose to get out of town and do more then simply fight. In Lilly's case, I never had her depart, despite the craptacular circumstances that would be involved in her getting rescued.The reasons I did this were two-fold; one was that I personally prefer there being consequences when I die in games, and the loss of half a rank didnt fit that bill for me. ( dont get me wrong - I think departing, on the whole, is a fine system, it just does not suit me personally) The other reason was that I had alot of friends who seemed to be lacking for "fun" things to do, and the damsel in distress bit is a tried and true classic for uniting heroes the land over. By the end though, I was getting the general impression that folks were going to hunt in the areas where I had fallen whether I was dead there or not, and me being fallen was just an added nuisance instead of added fun.

Arteress Lai

Althea

02-17-2003, 06:55 PM

Good topic.

On the clicking opposite gender thing, it used to be that female characters in clanlord weren't played by females because essentially there practically were no female players. By the time of the rip war and the move to commercial, HGM said that 10% of the player base was female, while Joe said 5%. I've usually settled on 7.5%. Seems to match what I knew/know about who was really female and who wasn't.

There was also (in response to what Mehan said) a poll done informally about which races females were most likely to experience harassment. I think Thoom was the lowest and Zo the second lowest. Highest was Dwarf, followed by human or sylvan.. can't remember which. There were definitely racial differences.

Some of the things you see in clanlord to "control" player behavior came out of the harassment policy discussions btwn players and DT pre-rip. Ignore/block along with compla (which is now supplanted by the \report command, tho' I don't know if it puts a text logging function on the reported player like compla does) and even the courts were all DT's efforts to allow players the tools to deal with snerts. I think all of this, along with the small size of clanlord and the culture of intolerance of sexual harassment, makes clanlord a pretty female friendly place.

Anyway... regarding rp, Althea definitely has elements of my character in her. I have other characters but given how much I enjoy the game mechanics/hunt/explore part of cl, Thea is the most fun for me due to her ranks. My other characters who are farther from me are more work to play and hence, not as relaxing as the Sylvan Bitch from HELL

Unregistered

02-18-2003, 08:33 AM

Originally posted by Michael

If some guy ever started hitting on me (for real, not just f...ing around) I would f...ing puke all over my monitor.

Many female players feel exactly the same way. Please pass the paper towels.

Fortunately CL has easy ways of dealing with that. What is harder is the guys who are just a little too nice. Hard to tell if its just subconcious or what, and you don't want to be rude if they didn't mean it that way. That's when I trot out my male character or my Zo.

Althea

02-19-2003, 09:12 PM

If someone is taking interaction is a direction that makes you uncomfortable or that you don't wish to engage in, I've found it useful to say to them <b>privately</b> "ooc that's not ok with me. don't do/say that." That way, you're clearly setting up a line and doing so in a way that doesn't embarrass them (embarrassing them can create fallout you don't want to deal with...) If they disregard your request, then you can take other action to deal with it. (Including objecting loudly and publicly so others know he's bugging you.)

But mostly, the culture of clanlord currently is such that folks seem to respect limits. If someone is making you uncomfortable, there's prolly a reason they're making you uncomfortable. Simply avoid them. There's one exile (I won't name names) who consistantly hits on Althea.. or he used to, until I simply stopped talking to him. He would either directly hit on her, or say things that were... I dunno, just made me uncomfortable. I completely ignore him now (not using tools to do it, I just don't interact.) He leaves Althea alone and is civil on the rare occasions we do interact.

anyway.. there I go babbling again...

Lex

02-20-2003, 08:03 AM

Lex was originally created to be my healer, as I had a fighter I was playing at the time and wanted to play a healer too. But after a couple days I decided I didn't want her to be a healer after all. Partly because of the way many sylvan females acted - I just wanted her to be different from the overly nice and sweet sylvan female healer stereotype. So I created for her a somewhat confrontational disposition, modelled after a RL girl who's personality I "borrowed" and thought it would be perfect for Lex.

Lex was fun to play and eventaully became my primary character, and although I try to be IC, my own personality has blended in a great deal - mostly I think because you so often go OOC with people anyway. But she often gets in your face about things that in RL I could easily ignore. I try to not go too far if it's upsetting to someone, but sometimes you can't help it.

If there's one thing about Lex that is exactly the same as me, it's her training choices. She's good at just about everything, with no real long stretches of any one trainer to have what could be considered a "specialty". That's probably my personality leaking in - I get real bored doing the same thing or I guess training the same thing.

Lex